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								<p>Agreed with <a class="mention" href="/u/astonj" rel="nofollow">@AstonJ</a> . I have an aside to share.</p>
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/astonj/48/15_2.png" class="avatar"> AstonJ:</div>
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<p>I actually think this is one of Elixir’s killer features; there’s not just - like in some other languages or frameworks - a single “____'s way”, there are several!</p>
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<p>This will never be either a positive nor a negative. It seriously depends on how this freedom is used. Take a look at Javascript’s supposed freedom – it led to a huge sprawl of libraries and frameworks which ultimately (and very logically) led to the <a href="https://www.reddit.com/r/learnprogramming/comments/4bo951/eli5_this_whole_fiasco_with_javascript_node_and/" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">NPM left-pad fiasco</a>.</p>
<p>A sad fact of life is that most humans do not seem to be able to utilize their full freedom without introducing anarchy in the system, and without the ego being the first priority behind almost every action of any singular agent inside the system. This is why, if you ask any Eastern European, I could bet that 8 / 10 of us will tell you that <em>some</em> control and authoritarianism are actually good for the system as a whole, provided the “dictator” or “the ruling class” are benevolent (which is a stretch and has been historically proven as impossible in politics at least; seems to work well with the right people in tech though, the leading example being Linus Torvalds).</p>
<p>Back to the topic at hand:</p>
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/astonj/48/15_2.png" class="avatar"> AstonJ:</div>
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<p>I love how Phoenix and Elixir offer you the flexibility to do things how you want.</p>
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<p>Me too. But I want that flexibility <em>only inside</em> Phoenix and co. I don’t need that flexibility in the form of yet-another-framework. I personally would dislike seeing a lot of frameworks coming into being that try and do things that Phoenix already does quite well. We need to be productive. The eternal illusion of the “infinitely free choice” is holding the industry back. We want to ship and deliver, our employers’ systems are not playgrounds, we should stop pretending we are 19 and we should <em>specifically</em> stop pretending that programming is only a passion and not at all a job. I am not taking shots at any enthusiastic open-source maintainer here – sometimes the alternate tech serves really good to make you think about other possibilities and this cognitive ability expansion is priceless! – and I admire the people who use their personal time to try and move an area forward. But I for one will still not replace Phoenix or Plug and would rather struggle with them for a bit until next version fixes a problem, compared to fully jumping ship somewhere else and fragmenting the community’s efforts and energy.</p>
<p>The community needs unity. All tech communities need less fashion and ego. This is ultimately a job and we must pick not only the best tools for the job; sometimes we have to settle for picking the <em>good enough</em> tools for the job if it means we will make the job of the guy / girl after us easier and more pleasant.</p>
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/astonj/48/15_2.png" class="avatar"> AstonJ:</div>
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<p>Thank you Chris, José, Dave and everyone else who have helped make all this possible - I really do think it’s one of Elixir’s killer features <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/purple_heart.png?v=15" title=":purple_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":purple_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/orange_heart.png?v=15" title=":orange_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":orange_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/yellow_heart.png?v=15" title=":yellow_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":yellow_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/hearts.png?v=15" title=":hearts:" class="emoji" alt=":hearts:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/green_heart.png?v=15" title=":green_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":green_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/blue_heart.png?v=15" title=":blue_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":blue_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/purple_heart.png?v=15" title=":purple_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":purple_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
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<p>Agreed! I will cheer them if I meet them in person (okay I met Jose once but it was 2 years ago) and will tell them they make the tech world a much better place.</p>
<p>And I prefer to stick to their work – Jose, Eric, Michal, Chris and everybody else who works on Elixir, Plug, Phoenix, Ecto, and even contributes to Erlang / OTP.</p>
<p>We need more unity.</p> 
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/dimitarvp/48/38664_2.png" class="avatar"> dimitarvp:</div>
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<p>This will never be either a positive nor a negative. It seriously depends on how this freedom is used.</p>
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<p>I genuinely feel it will be (a positive). Like you said, it depends on how we go about it <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/slight_smile.png?v=15" title=":slight_smile:" class="emoji" alt=":slight_smile:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
<p>If you look at the extremes - the ‘Rails’ way on the one hand, and the gazillion different ways in JS land - Elixir &amp; Phoenix are opting for something far more sane, with the three I mentioned (and perhaps one or two other emerging ideas which seem worthy of exploration).</p>
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<p>Me too. But I want that flexibility <em>only inside</em> Phoenix and co. I don’t need that flexibility in the form of yet-another-framework.</p>
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<p>I don’t think we are going to see a lot of frameworks, purely because Chris, José and the Phoenix core team have been astute enough to make Phoenix flexible and suited to many different needs <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/smiley.png?v=15" title=":smiley:" class="emoji" alt=":smiley:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"> It blew my mind when I discovered you can have more than one Phoenix layer in an Elixir app <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/d/d533b0965fb58a59fa0c46e0ae4f3b1c9f891a33.gif?v=15" title=":icon_eek:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":icon_eek:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/5/5d992e81a0fb5b792714a9c777e18e9dab623d41.gif?v=15" title=":103:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":103:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/3X/4/f/4f18d8c5fb91348b81287d77f3409347569e5e3c.png?v=15" title=":101:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":101:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/6/6859d251eb1d30084c330dd451119e07820d3619.gif?v=15" title=":007:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":007:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"><img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/6/6c3193d1dd46244da3c8c6f719c9f5e2abdd5ae8.gif?v=15" title=":003:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":003:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/dimitarvp/48/38664_2.png" class="avatar"> dimitarvp:</div>
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<p>We need more unity.</p>
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<p>Waaaaaaaaat - we’ve got loads <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/7/776053aa22968f83c10e90c98b23aa0ddd5c9d47.gif?v=15" title=":lol:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":lol:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
<p>I think part of the reason for this is how José and Chris solicit feedback and include the community in conversations and the decision making process. Some of the most popular threads on this forum are in the <a class="hashtag-cooked" href="/tag/elixir-news/3146" data-type="tag" data-slug="elixir-news" data-id="3146" data-style-type="icon" data-icon="tag" rel="nofollow"><span class="hashtag-icon-placeholder"><svg class="fa d-icon d-icon-square-full svg-icon svg-node"><use href="#square-full"></use></svg></span><span>elixir-news</span></a> and <span class="hashtag-raw">#phoenix-forum:phoenix-news</span> sections (hopefully soon in the <span class="hashtag-raw">#nerves-forum:nerves-news</span> too!).</p>
<p>When I came to Elixir it was for the speed and scalability, but what I’ve stayed for is the ‘better way of doing things’ - a question I often asked in other languages. I was pleasantly surprised to find the closest thing to an answer here in Elixir  <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/purple_heart.png?v=15" title=":purple_heart:" class="emoji" alt=":purple_heart:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p> 
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								<p>Oh I am not saying we have no unity. On the contrary, this is the most united and friendly community I have ever had to honor to belong in.</p>
<p>I am mostly saying that we must keep it that way. <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/a/af393cb8cedadfa17ff6dcccacb282d1cfd30071.gif?v=15" title=":049:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":049:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p> 
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/dimitarvp/48/38664_2.png" class="avatar"> dimitarvp:</div>
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<p>This will never be either a positive nor a negative. It seriously depends on how this freedom is used.</p>
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<p>Yes, and so far Elixir seems to be striking a good balance, with reasonable alternatives that deserve to exist, rather than a big pile of half-baked ideas that we have to wade through to find the best fit.</p>
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<p>I think part of the reason for this is how José and Chris solicit feedback and include the community in conversations and the decision making process.</p>
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<p>So very very true! (And they’re really smart, and they’ve built/attracted a good community…)</p> 
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