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		          <img alt="blatyo" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/blatyo/120/4554_2.png" width="120" height="120" />
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		            <h3>
                  blatyo
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									<span>Conduit Core Team</span>
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								<aside class="quote group-livebook_core_team" data-username="josevalim" data-post="9" data-topic="17182">
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/josevalim/48/1787_2.png" class="avatar"> josevalim:</div>
<blockquote>
<p>Ecto 3.0 will already leverage Telemetry though.</p>
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<p>Is telemetry expected to stabilize before Ecto 3.0 is released? Currently it says:</p>
<blockquote>
<p><strong>NOTICE</strong> : This library is in very much alpha stage. API may (and probably will!) change in unpredictable ways. Use with caution.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>If Ecto 3.0 includes Telemetry with an API that changes in a later version of Telemetry, wouldn’t an upgrade to that version be considered a breaking change (assuming the differences are visible to the user)?</p> 
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                  dwahyudi
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<p>The new generators also use <a href="https://milligram.io" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">Milligram</a></p>
</blockquote>
<p>How about not to include any css library at all?</p> 
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								<aside class="quote group-Phoenix-Core-Team quote-modified" data-username="chrismccord" data-post="1" data-topic="17182">
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/chrismccord/48/24233_2.png" class="avatar"> chrismccord:</div>
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<p>…phoenix includes a new <code>phx.gen.cert</code> task which generates a self-signed certificate for HTTPS testing in development.</p>
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<p>Thank you, it’s a very small thing but very much appreciated</p> 
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								<p>Indeed, I’ve wasted a lot of time trying to generate ssl certs for development.</p>
<p>Also congratulations on 1.4-rc0 Phoenix has been a pleasure to work with, thank you for your hard work!</p> 
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									<span>Creator of Phoenix</span>
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								<p>It’s important for things to look nice out-of-the-box, as well as be usable. This matters for prototypes, as well as beginners just getting started. The amount of effort to remove is deleting <code>phoenix.css</code> and removing the import from your app.css file.</p> 
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								<p>Out of the box for backend, perhaps.</p>
<p>But out of the box for frontend, Rails does this, and it is awful. <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/worried.png?v=15" title=":worried:" class="emoji" alt=":worried:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
<p>I apologize, I’m only voicing my opinion.</p> 
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		            <h3>
                  brightball
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								<p>But Elixir runs on the backend…</p> 
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								<p>We’re talking about Phoenix. A web framework.</p> 
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								<p>It’s so minimal tho - 2kb. Just delete the css and it’s as good as never have been there <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/uploads/default/original/2X/6/6c3193d1dd46244da3c8c6f719c9f5e2abdd5ae8.gif?v=15" title=":003:" class="emoji emoji-custom" alt=":003:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p> 
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/dwahyudi/48/347_2.png" class="avatar"> dwahyudi:</div>
<blockquote>
<p>How about not to include any css library at all?</p>
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</aside>
<p>I normally would immediately agree with you but after making a few test apps yesterday I can say that it’s trivial to remove Milligram. It’s a 1-minute job.</p>
<p>But I am actually quite impressed by it. Whoever made it is a magician.</p> 
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