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								<p><a class="mention" href="/u/jeg2" rel="nofollow">@JEG2</a> Hi. First of all, thank you for the book. I learned a lot.</p>
<p>I have a question about data validation. In the book you are doing it in the boundary layer. What if my validator has a bug and and invalid data gets through to the core? Is it OK if my core raises an error then? Or better to build the core that never breaks?</p>
<p>Example: A question can only accept answers “yes” and “no”. Every time you answer a question, it gets added to the list of responses in the quiz. But if the user somehow manages to answer “maybe”, which is invalid and the validator doesn’t catch it, we have options to: don’t add response to the list and return quiz unchanged, crash, return an error tuple.</p>
<p>Error tuple is not good for composition, not doing anything and returning the quiz is probably not what the user expected, and raising sounds quite good to me.</p>
<p>I hope I described the problem. What are your thoughts?</p> 
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/egze/48/13522_2.png" class="avatar"> egze:</div>
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<p>Error tuple is not good for composition, not doing anything and returning the quiz is probably not what the user expected, and raising sounds quite good to me.</p>
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<p>It composes quite well with <code>with</code> and various other constructs.  <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/slight_smile.png?v=15" title=":slight_smile:" class="emoji" alt=":slight_smile:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
<p>It really just depends on what ‘kind’ of error it should be though.  Like should it be handleable first of all?</p> 
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								<p>It’s a good question if it should be handleable. I guess sometimes yes, sometimes no. This is the code I wrote today:</p>
<pre data-code-wrap="elixir"><code class="lang-elixir">def answer_question(pitch, question_id, answer) do
  response = Response.new(pitch, question_id, answer)
  
  add_response(pitch, response)
end
  
defp add_response(pitch, %Response{valid: false}), do: pitch
defp add_response(pitch, %Response{valid: true} = response) do
  %Pitch{pitch | responses: Map.put(pitch.responses, response.question_id, response)}
end
</code></pre>
<p>Here only a valid response gets added to the map. We were debating with a co-worker if raising an error for the invalid response is a better approach than silently returning the pitch untouched. His argument was that the validation in the boundary layer can be buggy/incomplete and invalid data can leak into the core. He would then prefer to know about it, instead of silently returning the pitch.</p>
<p>In our case with questions and answers it is actually better like it is, because there is no handling of errors for this use-case. But I can also see his point of view, that if this was a more critical use-case, then it would be better to deal with it somehow.</p> 
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								<p>My preference would be to return a tagged tuple and not to swallow it.  I would expect the frontend to turn it into a helpful notification for the user, even if that’s just “Something has gone wrong.  We have been notified…”</p>
<p>I try to reserve raising errors for the cases where there’s no viable action left to take.</p> 
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								<p>But in the book you were never returning tuples from functional core, even when you were expecting user submitted data. Instead you validated in the boundary layer, but if it would somehow fail to validate correctly, then the core would have invalid state. Just trying to unterstand what strategies are better, not attacking your solution <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/slight_smile.png?v=15" title=":slight_smile:" class="emoji" alt=":slight_smile:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p> 
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								<p>I think I’m missing something in this discussion.  Why would validation code at the boundaries be buggy while code deep in the core won’t be?</p>
<p>We almost surely don’t want to validate in both places, right?  The two sources of truth would eventually drift apart.</p>
<p>Finally, there’s no reason a functional core can’t return errors.  There’s a section, in the Boundaries chapter no less, about the value of treating errors as data.  Consider how Phoenix controllers interact with contexts, for example.</p>
<p>Anyway, I feel like I’m not really grasping your query.  What am I missing?</p> 
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								<p>That’s a good point about not wanting to validate in both places. I guess we were trying too hard to protect the system. And core is like a last chance to save the state from getting invalid. Wrong way to think about it. Totally makes sense that the validations will drift apart.</p>
<p>Now after this discussion, I’m planning to remove this function:</p>
<pre data-code-wrap="elixir"><code class="lang-elixir">defp add_response(pitch, %Response{valid: false}), do: pitch
</code></pre>
<p>Also don’t check in <code>add_response</code> if the response in valid or not, but just add it. And the Validator in the boundary will take care of checking if we should call <code>add_response</code> in the first place.</p> 
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								<p>On page 154, in the section describing concurrency:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Concurrency</p>
<p>In the simplest terms, concurrency means doing more than one thing at the same time. In our <strong>venacular</strong>, it’s a micro concern.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>I believe you mean <a href="https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/vernacular" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">vernacular</a> instead <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/smiley.png?v=15" title=":smiley:" class="emoji" alt=":smiley:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
<p>A few lines later:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>A client request can <strong>farm</strong> out six different database</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Don’t you mean <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fan-out_(software)" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">fan out</a>?  I never heard the term <em>farm out</em> but in case this is not a typo, I would really like to learn more about it!</p> 
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/fl4m3ph03n1x/48/11709_2.png" class="avatar"> Fl4m3Ph03n1x:</div>
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<p>I never heard the term <em>farm out</em> but in case this is not a typo, I would really like to learn more about it!</p>
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<p>It’s as colloquialism</p>
<p><a href="https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/farm%20out" class="onebox" target="_blank" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/farm%20out</a></p>
<p>Specifically:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>to turn over for performance by another usually under contract<br>
<strong>farm out a job</strong></p>
</blockquote>
<p>So it’s often used to mean “outsourcing work”.</p> 
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								<p>Ahh, given the context this makes sense. Thanks !</p> 
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