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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/benwilson512/48/1457_2.png" class="avatar"> benwilson512:</div>
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<p>Cultural values in the programming world constitute things like code and library best practices, attitude towards beginners, and the overall tone of dialogue.</p>
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<aside class="quote no-group" data-username="sergio" data-post="11" data-topic="6718">
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<p>I would hate to see Elixir turn into a javascript-like ecosystem.</p>
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<p>JavaScript emerged in 1995 and was trapped, for the most part, in the web browser (Netscape Enterprise Server and Rhino notwithstanding) until in 2009 Node.js allowed it to expand its horizons beyond the web browser in a more mainstream context - which apparently was necessary before a lot of people changed their attitude towards it.</p>
<p>Erlang first appeared in 1986 and was designed to be functional, concurrent and fault-tolerant to satisfy key demands of its application domain on the most fundamental level. This lead to the development of the BEAM virtual machine which saw it’s first use first commercial use in 1995. In 2011 Elixir started to make the BEAM more accessible to an audience which potentially would have avoided it based on Erlang’s perceived strange syntax and concepts.</p>
<p>It’s unlikely that these different evolutionary paths would tend to foster similar cultures.</p>
<p>Nevertheless, it’s always worthwhile to be vigilant.</p>
<p>FYI: <a href="http://www.cbc.ca/passionateeye/features/the-hipster-an-old-term-thats-taken-on-a-whole-new-meaning" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">The Hipster: An Old Term that’s Taken on a Whole New Meaning</a></p> 
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								<p>So… firstly: the TIOBE index is completely meaningless. I mean .. VB. c’mon <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/wink.png?v=15" title=":wink:" class="emoji" alt=":wink:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
<p>Their metric of search engine relevance is just so obviously without meaning I’m not sure why anyone takes it seriously. That is not a data set that follows current trends, but discussion and noise. Which correlates coarsely to usage, and certainly will show strongly for more often used languages.</p>
<p>But even if we assume that there is meaning in those numbers, the small numbers for those languages outside the top 20 or so are so small and with so little spread between them, any tiny perturbation will show up huge. So languages jump and fall 5-10 spaces .. and it means nothing.</p>
<p>But it is good for TIOBE to keep relevance and eyeballs pointed at them. Ok, part 1: The Critique of TIOBE,  done</p> 
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								<p>So .. what can we do to grow Elixir?</p>
<p>IMHO:</p>
<ul>
<li>improve documentation. it still isn’t good enough. this is low-hanging fruit. (i should take my own advice here)</li>
<li>reach out to companies and open source projects to make them aware of the benefits of Elixir</li>
<li>attend local tech events and spread the word</li>
<li>create more awesome libraries</li>
<li>create <em>end user applications</em> that people can download and use</li>
</ul>
<p>On that last point .. I use node.js on one of my servers because of Ghost, a blogging platform. It is quite nice from a user’s perspective, but their use of node is just horrible for maintenance and deployment. But, it provides a useful application.</p>
<p>What application is useful, that is written in Elixir, that I could use on my server? Honest question <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/slight_smile.png?v=15" title=":slight_smile:" class="emoji" alt=":slight_smile:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p> 
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<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/aseigo/48/10674_2.png" class="avatar"> aseigo:</div>
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<p>On that last point .. I use node.js on one of my servers because of Ghost, a blogging platform. It is quite nice from a user’s perspective, but their use of node is just horrible for maintenance and deployment. But, it provides a useful application.</p>
<p>What application is useful, that is written in Elixir, that I could use on my server? Honest question <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/slight_smile.png?v=15" title=":slight_smile:" class="emoji" alt=":slight_smile:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p>
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<p>What about: <a href="https://forum.elixirforum.com/t/sceopa-an-open-source-blogging-platform/3702" class="inline-onebox" rel="nofollow">Sceopa - an open source blogging platform</a></p>
<p>There’s also <a href="https://forum.elixirforum.com/t/announcing-firestorm-forum-built-with-phoenix/6735" rel="nofollow">Firestorm</a>, which could be skinned to look like a blog perhaps?</p>
<p>But yeah, I think it would be nice to have a Wordpress alternative in Elixir - I’m sure it would attract some of the big blogs out there as Wordpress is a hog.</p> 
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								<p>Doesn’t necessarily need to be blog related .. just a great app.</p>
<p>eJabberd is a good example for erlang.</p> 
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								<p>I dunno, I reckon as soon as some hot **** startup makes a bunch of money with an Elixir stack, the floodgates will open. Enjoy the quiet times. <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/wink.png?v=15" title=":wink:" class="emoji" alt=":wink:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"></p> 
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								<p>The latest Tiobe index doesn’t show Elixir at all.<br>
I’m not sure if that means it’s dropped out of the top 100, or if they’ve just stopped tracking it.<br>
Redmonk’s rankings should be out this month so it should be interesting to see where they place it.</p> 
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								<p>Elixir’s ranking on somebody’s index is the last thing I care about.  The work I see in the Eixir community is excellent.  A smaller more cohesive group can often outperform a large unruly mass.</p> 
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								<p>It doesn’t change my opinion of Elixir, but it does make a difference for someone trying to convince their employer, or client to let them use Elixir.</p>
<p>I think Tiobe tends to over rate languages that are used for learning like Scratch over languages that are more industry focussed like Erlang and Elixir.</p> 
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								<p>There’s something weird going on. Erlang increased from 0.4% to 1.2% since November. I just can’t see where such a big change would be coming from in such a short period of time. Did they start counting Elixir and Erlang together?</p>
<p>November ratings: <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20171208062738/https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/" class="inline-onebox" rel="noopener nofollow ugc">TIOBE Index | TIOBE - The Software Quality Company</a></p> 
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