<turbo-stream action="append" target="posts_list"><template>    <div class="postbit" id="380894" data-post-id="380894">
  <section>
    <div class="post-wrap">


					<div class="post-header">
		        <div class="user-avatar">
		          <img alt="Schultzer" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/Schultzer/120/4339_2.png" width="120" height="120" />
		        </div>
					
						<div class="user-details">
		          <div class="user-name">
		            <h3>
                  Schultzer
                  </h3>
		          </div>
						
						</div>
					
					</div>

	        <div class="thread-main">
	            <div class="post-body" data-turbo="false">
								<p>I feel you’re extrapolating a bit here, I never said evidence isn’t good enough. I even stated that I use AI, so I do have some experience with what is available out there. Although I do think it’s rather hype driven right now, and at no point do I see anyone being left behind rather they use AI or not. I suspect the people that still aren’t using it will catch up at some point the same way people moved from hard covered manuals and usenet to Google and stack overflow. There is only so much a probabilistic modal can do.</p>
<p>Getting us to 80% was a huge achievement, but it’s the fat tails that might pop this bubble. How much money can we really put in before the return on investment can’t justify it?</p> 
	            </div>

	            <div class="base-line">
	                <div class="thread-counters">
	                    <span class="thread-count count-likes js-likers-trigger" title="Likes" data-post-id="380894" data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                        1
                      </span>
                      <!-- <span class="thread-count js-solved-indicator" title="Marked as solution"></span> -->
	                </div>
	                <div class="go-to-post">
	                  <a title="Go to post" alt="Go to post" href="https://forum.elixirforum.com/t/change-my-mind-the-optimal-ai-prompt-is-the-code-itself/73378/72">Post #71</a>
	                </div>
	            </div>
              <div id="likers-container-380894" 
                   class="likers-container"
                   data-first-post="false"
                   data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                   <div class="likers-placeholder" 
                     data-likers-post-id="380894"
                     data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                  <div class="post-likers"></div>
                </div>
              </div>
	        </div>
			

    </div>

    <div class="triangle-top-right type-standard-post cat-standard-post" title="Post #71"></div>
  </section>
</div>
    <div class="postbit" id="380899" data-post-id="380899">
  <section>
    <div class="post-wrap">


					<div class="post-header">
		        <div class="user-avatar">
		          <img alt="garrison" src="/assets/icons/user-9f439610.png" width="120" height="120" />
		        </div>
					
						<div class="user-details">
		          <div class="user-name">
		            <h3>
                  garrison
                  </h3>
		          </div>
						
						</div>
					
					</div>

	        <div class="thread-main">
	            <div class="post-body" data-turbo="false">
								<p>I continue to have little interest in this topic but I just want to drop in to say that Andrej is not some AI influencer. He was training neural nets before AlexNet and has worked at multiple top labs. He is also an excellent educator, probably the best the field has ever had.</p>
<p>I mention this because I understand that in this hype hellscape we live in it is legitimately hard to tell the difference. Andrej is an OG and deserves respect.</p>
<p>He is not, however, a professional programmer, so I would put less weight on his opinions there. There are many professional programmers who have expressed a similar sentiment, though.</p> 
	            </div>

	            <div class="base-line">
	                <div class="thread-counters">
	                    <span class="thread-count count-likes js-likers-trigger" title="Likes" data-post-id="380899" data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                        4
                      </span>
                      <!-- <span class="thread-count js-solved-indicator" title="Marked as solution"></span> -->
	                </div>
	                <div class="go-to-post">
	                  <a title="Go to post" alt="Go to post" href="https://forum.elixirforum.com/t/change-my-mind-the-optimal-ai-prompt-is-the-code-itself/73378/73">Post #72</a>
	                </div>
	            </div>
              <div id="likers-container-380899" 
                   class="likers-container"
                   data-first-post="false"
                   data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                   <div class="likers-placeholder" 
                     data-likers-post-id="380899"
                     data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                  <div class="post-likers"></div>
                </div>
              </div>
	        </div>
			

    </div>

    <div class="triangle-top-right type-standard-post cat-standard-post" title="Post #72"></div>
  </section>
</div>
    <div class="postbit" id="380980" data-post-id="380980">
  <section>
    <div class="post-wrap">


					<div class="post-header">
		        <div class="user-avatar">
		          <img alt="drobban" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/drobban/120/21893_2.png" width="120" height="120" />
		        </div>
					
						<div class="user-details">
		          <div class="user-name">
		            <h3>
                  drobban
                  </h3>
		          </div>
						
						</div>
					
					</div>

	        <div class="thread-main">
	            <div class="post-body" data-turbo="false">
								<p>This starts to move outside the bounds of the original topic <img src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/images/emoji/apple/sweat_smile.png?v=15" title=":sweat_smile:" class="emoji" alt=":sweat_smile:" loading="lazy" width="20" height="20"> .</p>
<aside class="quote no-group" data-username="GrammAcc" data-post="50" data-topic="73378">
<div class="title">
<div class="quote-controls"></div>
<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/grammacc/48/40380_2.png" class="avatar"> GrammAcc:</div>
<blockquote>
<p>stateful connections (HTTP2/3, websockets) started becoming commonplace, which is really weird because stateful connections are actually a pretty good fit for OOP patterns (though I still prefer immutability everywhere personally).</p>
</blockquote>
</aside>
<p>I would argue that OTP is the perfect implementation of OOP.</p>
<p>If OOP is defined as methods wrapped around mutable data.<br>
I dont see why that would handle state better. In fact, I would argue it makes state handling worse - how is one able to reason about the current state in a system where its total sum building up the state is spread to a multitude of “objects” and it arrived at its current state is an combinatorial explosion</p>
<aside class="quote no-group" data-username="GrammAcc" data-post="50" data-topic="73378">
<div class="title">
<div class="quote-controls"></div>
<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/grammacc/48/40380_2.png" class="avatar"> GrammAcc:</div>
<blockquote>
<p>and it seems like this is the first time that the entire industry is pushing people to use a single tool without really considering the merits of it at all. Even people that have no vested interest in it.</p>
</blockquote>
</aside>
<p>I think you forgot about the dot com era.<br>
Everyone was about to become millionaires in this new tech - Internet.<br>
It had merits, but no one was sure about what exactly.<br>
People poured money on products/companies no one understood. There are plenty of examples that I believe have a perfect match with today’s current AI situation.</p> 
	            </div>

	            <div class="base-line">
	                <div class="thread-counters">
	                    <span class="thread-count count-likes js-likers-trigger" title="Likes" data-post-id="380980" data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                        1
                      </span>
                      <!-- <span class="thread-count js-solved-indicator" title="Marked as solution"></span> -->
	                </div>
	                <div class="go-to-post">
	                  <a title="Go to post" alt="Go to post" href="https://forum.elixirforum.com/t/change-my-mind-the-optimal-ai-prompt-is-the-code-itself/73378/74">Post #73</a>
	                </div>
	            </div>
              <div id="likers-container-380980" 
                   class="likers-container"
                   data-first-post="false"
                   data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                   <div class="likers-placeholder" 
                     data-likers-post-id="380980"
                     data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                  <div class="post-likers"></div>
                </div>
              </div>
	        </div>
			

    </div>

    <div class="triangle-top-right type-standard-post cat-standard-post" title="Post #73"></div>
  </section>
</div>
    <div class="postbit" id="380981" data-post-id="380981">
  <section>
    <div class="post-wrap">


					<div class="post-header">
		        <div class="user-avatar">
		          <img alt="drobban" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/drobban/120/21893_2.png" width="120" height="120" />
		        </div>
					
						<div class="user-details">
		          <div class="user-name">
		            <h3>
                  drobban
                  </h3>
		          </div>
						
						</div>
					
					</div>

	        <div class="thread-main">
	            <div class="post-body" data-turbo="false">
								<aside class="quote no-group" data-username="tfwright" data-post="51" data-topic="73378">
<div class="title">
<div class="quote-controls"></div>
<img alt="" width="24" height="24" src="https://forum.elixirforum.com/user_avatar/forum.elixirforum.com/tfwright/48/20299_2.png" class="avatar"> tfwright:</div>
<blockquote>
<p>Unfortunately I think that may be because this is a socio-political watershed moment more than a technological one.</p>
</blockquote>
</aside>
<p>I would argue its both.</p>
<p>People are for real building solutions where AI agents performs tasks with absolutely zero deterministic end result for absolutely no other reason then “its AI” so its cool - management to be able to say they have started using AI.<br>
That isnt socio-political - its just poor engineering and bad use of tools.</p>
<p>Then we also have the situation of people acting as a proxy for LLMs, which I also argue is poor engineering.<br>
The best explanation im able to provide for “acting as proxy” - is when people start behaving like they did during the stackoverflow era, when people just copy/pasted answers into the code base until they got **** working.<br>
For example people inputting “their” own bad implementation of the modulo operator into the code base. I guess you get what picture im trying to paint here.</p> 
	            </div>

	            <div class="base-line">
	                <div class="thread-counters">
	                    <span class="thread-count count-likes js-likers-trigger" title="Likes" data-post-id="380981" data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                        3
                      </span>
                      <!-- <span class="thread-count js-solved-indicator" title="Marked as solution"></span> -->
	                </div>
	                <div class="go-to-post">
	                  <a title="Go to post" alt="Go to post" href="https://forum.elixirforum.com/t/change-my-mind-the-optimal-ai-prompt-is-the-code-itself/73378/75">Post #74</a>
	                </div>
	            </div>
              <div id="likers-container-380981" 
                   class="likers-container"
                   data-first-post="false"
                   data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                   <div class="likers-placeholder" 
                     data-likers-post-id="380981"
                     data-batch-url="/posts/batch_likers">
                  <div class="post-likers"></div>
                </div>
              </div>
	        </div>
			

    </div>

    <div class="triangle-top-right type-last-post cat-last-post" title="Last post!"></div>
  </section>
</div>
</template></turbo-stream><turbo-stream action="replace" target="load-more-container"><template><div id="load-more-container" class="load-more-container">
    <span class="all-loaded">— All posts loaded —</span>
</div></template></turbo-stream>